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Subject: I've made the biggest mistake of my life, what now
Posted By hippychick91 on 15-12-2009
I recently remarried and very shortly afterwards realised I had made a big mistake. I'm totally at a loss of what to do and where I stand. The house we live in is mine. solely in my name and i pay all the bills etc. I have two children(not with my current husband who are 17 and 13 and live with me fulltime). I have been married approx two months. The situation at home is impossible. My children absolutely hate my new husband because they see how he treats me. The constant arguments are making it uncomfortable for us all and the kids and i spend all our time in our bedrooms. Without going into to much detail where do I stand ? I just want out of this marriage asap for my sake and my kids sake. My husband and I also own an apartment in Spain that is in both names. I put down a large deposit on it and he now pay the mortgage on it and he also has a half share in a house in Ireland. Will he be entitled to a share of my home?
I;ve asked him to move out but he won't. I have been such a fool. Is there any light at the end of this.?
Follow up comments
Added By hippychick91 on 15-12-2009
I should add I have owned the house(mortgaged for approx 17 years and it was the childrens and my home before I met my new husband. He paid for the bathroom to be refurbished and some fencing but has never contributed anything else. I totally support our home, my children and feed and clothe him,
Added By sometimesitdoesn'twork on 15-12-2009
Unfortunately you cannot divorce and no financial orders can be made until you have been married for a year.
Without details it is only possible to generalise but the usual authority on short marriages is that each party takes away what they brought to the marriage. However, the length of the marriage is only one factor of several and the priority is the welfare of any children of the family regardless of whether they are natural children of the relationship or not. So apart from possibly reimbursement for the home improvements unless your H needs *something* towards rehousing and readjustment he won't have much claim, if any, on the matrimonial home.
Perhaps ways to move matters forward would be through mediation or negotiating through solicitors.
Added By obiwan_kenobi_again on 15-12-2009
crap- i am reminded of my own sit... i owned my own home and one in Poland...
when we divorced- i lost both in order to keep my pension.
stidw is right about the no divorce law though...
you are in a better position than mine - because you have children and tey will be seen as the priority...
still- i think it wont be as easy as sidw says.... it wasnt for me..
Added By hippychick91 on 15-12-2009
Thanks for that. I can see now how stupid I have been. My husband pushed all the way to get married even when I was unsure and I stupidly would not listen to my own head. He is now unemployed though receives a pension. We bought Spain between us three years ago and it is in joint names. He paid to have bathroom refurbished about 12 months ago. He has lived with me for approx 12 months. Prior to this he worked away in Ireland and lived in a house which he has a joint share in. The house at present is rented and up for sale. I have owned my own home for 17 years. Twelve with my last husband and the last five my self. My current husband is not on the mortgage nor any bills. He does not contribute at all to the household. Bank accounts are all seperate and always have been. Any money received as rental income from property in Ireland and Spain go to my husband, directly into his account. I understand I can't do anything for 12 months, do I have any rights to ask him to move out of property?
Added By Kat007 on 15-12-2009
Oh dear what an awful place to be right now, I am so sorry this is happening to you and the kids.
I think that maybe a quick half hour with a solicitor may help to clarify whether you can ask him to leave, as you say house in your name and all bills too, and it is good news that your bank accounts are seperate also. I do hope he doesn't have access to these accounts if he does then stop it immediately.
And yes after a short marriage then leave with what you put in, as for property in Spain that is a different kettle of Fish(where did that saying come from? OBI) this may have to be sold or if you or he can buy each other out for a fair market value. I wish you luck but do pop in and see a solicitor anout have him removed from the property.
Added By Jools123 on 15-12-2009
I'm also sorry that this is happening to you but I too feel sorry for your husband. You've been in a marriage for 2 months and now want out. Surely he has some rights. Also, financially you accepted this situation when going into this marriage so in my opinion you shouldnt be moaning about what he does or doesnt contribute now. Surely that should have all been agreed upfront.
I dont think he should get more than he put in but if you are to benefit from him decorating the bathroon then why not offer to split the apartment in Spain and pay him a sum which equates to the cost of the bathroom and fencing. I would also suggest if his name is not on the deeds of your house then you have a right to ask him to leave.
There are four people to consider here not just three.
Added By sometimesitdoesn'twork on 15-12-2009
As you are married your H has rights to live in the matrimonial home and can register those rights with the Land Registry. You are well advised to consult a solicitor to find out where you stand and what the options are in your particular circumstances. As I said above the length of the marriage is only one factor among several. See Foster v Foster, in particular paragraph 21;
http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2003/565.html
For example, the length of the relationship rather than the duration of the marriage might be considered when there was a period of settled cohabitation before marriage and the fact your husband is unemployed may well increase his 'needs.'
Added By EnglishRose on 15-12-2009
This is counted as a short marriage. You will both be put into the position as if you had never been married rather than split 50/50. You cannot divorce for a year but you may be able to get him removed from the house. He would have to make an application to the court as a spouse's right to live in the matrimonial home. I suspect a practical answer and everyone will shoot me for this, will be for you to make it clear he has to move immimently and if he does not you could just put his stuff into storage when he's out and change the locks. Then he would need a court order to get back in and he may well not get it if you are applying for a judicial separatino order or start the legal proceedings for that although really what you want is divorce all ready to go when you've been married one year. If there has been any domestic violence you could get a non molestation order and oust him but that always feels morally wrong to me if there aer no grounds for it although gosh I bet it's easy to make a case - all 3 of you shut up ion your bed rooms hating the way he treats you - would be dead easy to get given how the courts favour resident mothers on those things.
On the money side you need to wokr out what you each put in and each take out to get you back to square one. you paid the mortgage all the time, he paid for the bathroom. That may well equal out.
You can work out your percentage contributions to jointly owned place too and he gets his share of that based on his contriution to the deposit etc.
Added By hippychick91 on 15-12-2009
i appreciate there are four people to consider here and that is why my husband is still in the house as i don't want to just throw him out but you must understand that the situation is impossble. The atmosphere is unbearable. Even when we ignore each other he is rude and abrupt to the kids, who are always polite. When I said he was unemployed I also mentioned he had a private pension. He is also at the beginning of starting up his own business so there is some earnings for that. Wholst he paid for the bathroom I have supported him fully for the last two years. I have also recently spent three thousand pounds on having the house decorated and christmas presents for his side of the family. Would it make any difference if he was to move out of the house of his own accord. At what point can i apply for a separation. I know you may be thinking 2 months isn;t long to make these decisions but I had major doubts before the wedding and wanted a pre nup but he would not agree to it. Everything was planned and I felt like i was unable to back down, hoping that things would change . I readily admit I have been stupid going through with it but i now can see clearly and with his behaviour over the past eight weeks I realise none of us can go on like this. Thanks for your advice
Added By LazyLizzie on 15-12-2009
Hippy, it may be that to end the marriage is the best thing for you and your children, but please don't jump in feet first to a divorce situation.
You say that you were pushed into the marriage by him - it sounds as though the children may be trying to push you back out of the marriage. The children are of an age to make trouble between the two of you and enjoy the power that they have. Please find somebody to talk this through with who can be impartial. I would hate for you to get the divorce that you think you want and then in a few years when your children have grown substantially more independent regret it.
If he is setting up a business and newly married with two teenagers under his feet who aren't 'his' then he is having a pretty hard time I would imagine. Please don't do anything too hasty. As far as I understand it you can't divorce for another 10 months so please try uing a few of them to see if you can't manage to resolve some of the issues betwen the pair of you.
Added By sometimesitdoesn'twork on 15-12-2009
We all make mistakes, after all we are only human. How long did you know each other before you got married?
The best thing would be if your husband moved out of the house of his own accord and you could come to some interim arrangement separating the finances. Possibly a mediator working with you both to come to an agreement that works for everyone would be a way forward.
You can make a separation agreement between you and if there the order is fair (ie within the s25 Matrimonial Causes Act 1973 criteria), there is full disclosure and both parties take legal advice it will hold some weight although a separation agreement can always be subject to review. The agreement can form the basis of a final settlement but if there is a dispute you may have to go through the whole process again.
A judicial separation is completely different, rare and usually used instead of divorce when one party doesn't want to get divorced - possibly for religious reasons. All the normal marital obligations come to an end but the reality is it can take 6 months or more to complete and often a judicial separation actually prolongs divorce.
Added By hippychick91 on 16-12-2009
Lazy Lizzie... we have known each other for 29 years though we were not together that that length of time. We met at 18 and were engaged for two years when I called it off, basically when I think back for much the same reasons. We have been together through out the years for a couple of short periods on and off. He was my first love. This time we have been together three years, the later two very stormy. I understand what you are saying about the kids but they really are not the cause. They stay out of the house most of the time or go to their dads because they hate the atmosphere and seeing me being spoken to like crap. The problem is us. We argue constantly. My partner drinks every day. Not to excess most days but every day. He's started smoking heavily even though he knows I hate it, questioning me over spending money on the kids(even though we have seperate bank accounts) demanding to be consulted before I spend and of my money. Taking a car back off me he gave me which caused a lot of stress as I am dependant on it with kids and work , When he has a drink he becomes argumentative . He goes out whenever he wants, never helps around the house(at all). I have tried talking to him about these issues but as far as he is concerned its all my fault. Even when he went missing after a christening for four hours and came back leggless and was highly abusive infront of the kids, all my fault. I am certainly NOT perfect, but I do believe in my childrens welfare is most important and living in this war zone is just not right
Added By obiwan_kenobi_again on 16-12-2009
so to sum up...
your kids didnt like him.
you had a stormy relationship...
for TWO YEARS...
you were worried enough to consider a 'pre-nup'...
BUT
you married hom anyway?
does not compute - kemo-sabi...
Added By Jools123 on 16-12-2009
It looks to me like your husband is under severe stress. Losing his job, turning to drink to take the edge off, feeling low self esteem - probably struggling to cope with living with two children, possibly feeling insecure about your bond with them.
Living with somebody else's child is difficult. It took me a year+ to adapt. I know I felt (and still do at times) pushed out when conversations took place between my partner and her son and I wasnt privy to them.....I think it was my general insecurity and feeling as if I'm not the most important person in my partners life - which I'm not, after all my partner probably feels the same about my daughter.
He's probably rude at the moment because there is no other way to converse with you. I have used this website on two separate occasions now, on the first occasion I got frustrated because not everybody agreed with me. Now I try and take stock of most opinions and I honestly feel you should do the same.
Talk with him. Ask him why he is rude.... say you want to be is friend and somehow try and work through this..... if nothing else it might smoooth matters enough to get a resolution either way.
Good Luck!
Added By Owl1 on 16-12-2009
Hippychick. I agree you have to put your kids first here. You are a mother first, wife second.
I think in the first instance you should talk to him and maybe suggest counselling. however if he is not receptive or agreeable you need to move on.
If that is the case then ask him to move out to give you some space
I actually wouldn't shoot ER for her above suggestion.
But then I live in a different country and all you would have to do would be apply to a Court for a Separation order which would say you could no longer live together and a supporting occupation order granting you occupancy of the house so as not to disrupt your children, which is much more sensible way of approaching things all round.
This must be an incredibly difficult time for you and your family. Look after yourself and your children first and foremost.
Added By Simes 2p on 16-12-2009
Stids, not read it all, but wouldn't he have a claim under TOLATA with a beneficial interest having contributed to the house.
I think there was a recent case involving it which changed the goalposts. TOLATA, TOLADA, WHATEVERA
Also, Hippy and nastyman bought the house in SPain together 3 years ago, yet he has changed to Mr Nasty in 2 months of marriage? Kids hate him? Wasn't that considered before the marriage?
Anyway, people are people and I spoke to a guy this morning who gave £50,000 to a religious cult because they said they would get his wife back for him. The divorce has just gone through! There is nothing stranger than the truth.
Added By sometimesitdoesn'twork on 16-12-2009
Simes, the recent case was Smith v Smith. The CA confirmed that usually it is more desirable to sort out the FMH within ancillary proceedings when the court considers all the circumstances. However, in the Smith case the wife resisted the divorce petition and the court found the delay in selling the FMH 'intolerable" (H couldn't afford to pay the £280k/a upkeep!) So although it appears to set a precedent that TOLATA may exceptionally be an alternative to waiting for ancillary relief as a general rule the FMH is still dealt with as part of divorce proceedings. Nearly Legal's summary is here;
http://nearlylegal.co.uk/blog/2009/12/chancery-or-family-the-former-matrimonial-home
Added By hippychick91 on 16-12-2009
Hi Thanks for all your advice. I honestly do read it all and consider what you say. My husband has not changed in just two months. It has been this way for a while but has just gotten worse and worse. Yes there were a lo tof problems before the marriage. I totally accept that I should not have married him and have said that from the beginning. It does actually ;COMPUTE: I have hoped and hoped things would change and he told me that most of the problems were because he felt insecure as I would not put his name on my house or marry him. His drinking has not started since he lost his job it's been this way for a while. I have talked to him about it but he says it is not a problem. I have tried to talk to him repeatedly about things but nothing changes. The kids never say a bad word to him and like i said are always respectful. It is him who does not want to be involved. He has his own kids."his words". He puts up with them under sufference and it is blatently obvious now.
I have made a mistake in thinking I could change him and going ahead with a marriage I guess I know(but hoped would)wouldn't work. I'm sorry but my kids will always come first to me. I messed up and have realised it. He won't change"his words'. He is nasty about my kids when he's arguing with me of late, if it's between them and him I'm afraid he really is history. I know that some will not like that but they don't have to.
So you see I've tried the talking route and it hasn't worked.
I guess with what i have told I might seem pretty heartless but all is not as it looks. He gets over 1400 a month pension even though he is unemployed and approx £400 a month plus from the business he is setting up.
Added By Owl1 on 17-12-2009
I don't think you heartless hippychick. I agree you can't stand by and watch your children being denigrated and abused.
He is an adult and obviously has enough of an income that he won't be homeless.
Added By Kat007 on 17-12-2009
Time to pop to the solicitor,
Mental abuse inflictted on you and your children are surely grounds to have him removed ffrom your house. Check and see you need to have him gone asap by the sounds of things Please keep posting and let us know how it goes. If you don't know any solicitors ring your local CAB and they will be able to give you a list of local solicitors and one's who are legal aid funded if that is needed. Good luck hunny
Added By EnglishRose on 17-12-2009
he's a total waste of space. Do what I say ab ove. Change the locks and don't let him back in and then let him go to court to get back in if he can which he won't I'm sure as it's such a very very short marriage. it's not fair on the chidlren to tolerate hi8m a second longer. YOu can get a non molestation order easily people do all the time even by making things up but you don't need to on the bassi of that above ,. Anyway as K says see a lawyer immediately.
Why did you let him marry you without the pre nup (not that they are very enforceable under English law anyway). Were you so desperate to be his wife?
Added By hippychick91 on 18-12-2009
Hi ER, no like I said everything was already planned, boked and in place for a long time and over the last year I guess the real him has begun to come out. When I asked for a pre nup he hit the roof saying he felt more insecure than ever , it caused a lot of bad feelings, right up to a few days before when he suddenly agreed. B then it was to late and then I read that it wasn't enforcable and something about if it was made under duress. Like I said. I was very stupid.
Added By EnglishRose on 19-12-2009
I think they must be made at least 6 weeks in advance and both sides have lawyers etc etc and even then it's not 100% sure they are enforceable but this is a short marriage. Tell him he needs to be out in a month and if he isn't then go the route I say - change locks and/or get non molestation order, assert yourself at home. Have men round even if they are just pretend loverss, get the teenagers to have 20 friends round every night down stairs. It's your house and he's an idito. assert yourself.
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